I thank the Leader of the Opposition for his question. We are making the decisions which are necessary to ensure that our defence forces have the facilities and capabilities that they need to keep Australians safe. We need to acknowledge that we did an independent report into the Defence estate to ensure it is fit for purpose, and that report followed an independent estate audit that found that many Defence properties are no longer are a priority for defence of Australia in the future. The report identified more than 50 sites that were underutilised across Australia. The funds required to maintain these sites are estimated to reach in excess of $2 billion over the next 25 years, with no direct contribution to capability outcomes.

When it comes to Victoria Barracks, I certainly understand the importance of that history, and that's why it is heritage listed. That's why there can't be any development or interference, with that heritage listing that applies not only to the main building there; it applies even to some of the roads and areas on the outside of that site. It is a major, major site that is currently underutilised. We have put forward practical plans, whether there, whether on the banks of the Derwent river where I stood with Premier Rockliff and that are going to be developed into housing for about 3,000 people or whether for the housing development that will take place in Adelaide on the two sites that have been identified and where I stood with Premier Malinauskas.

I understand the importance of heritage, and one of the ways that we can ensure that that heritage is protected and, indeed, enhanced is by giving some ordinary citizens access so that it isn't cut off from what is a part of Sydney, not that far from where I've spent a lot of my life. At the moment, there would be very few people who ever have access to what is a very large site in need of substantial Commonwealth investment just to be maintained, rather than utilised appropriately with full respect for the heritage of the site.