Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Health and Aged Care) | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is also to the Minister representing the Minister for Aged Care and Seniors, Senator McAllister. Can the minister confirm how many pensioners will lose their private health insurance additional rebate under Labor's $11 billion tax on older Australians?

Jenny McAllister (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme) | Link to this | Hansard source

Labor is investing over $3 billion in delivering more aged-care beds, more packages and better care for older Australians in the 2026-27 budget. To fund this investment into aged care, the government will return the PHI rebate for older Australians back to the same level paid by everyone else. We do understand that it will not be—

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Health and Aged Care) | Link to this | Hansard source

I have a point of order on relevance. I simply asked how many pensioners will be affected by this change, nothing else.

Sue Lines (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

The minister was getting to your question, and I'll continue to listen carefully.

Jenny McAllister (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme) | Link to this | Hansard source

The additional rebate is simply not the best way to spend precious taxpayer dollars on behalf of older Australians when we do need to do so much heavy lifting in aged care. The approach that we are taking will restore fairness to the rebate system and will free up funding to provide more dignity and care to older Australians.

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Health and Aged Care) | Link to this | Hansard source

Once again, it's on a point of relevance. If the minister doesn't know how many pensioners—

Sue Lines (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you, Senator Ruston. I hear that you've raised an objection. The minister is being relevant. I'm going to ask the minister to continue.

Jenny McAllister (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme) | Link to this | Hansard source

Under the proposed changes, all Australians will now receive the same private health support based on their income, not their age. All over 65s will still receive significant government subsidised discounts of up to 24 per cent on the premiums that private health insurers charge them, the same as the rest of the population. The average impact on those 65 years and older—

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Health and Aged Care) | Link to this | Hansard source

Once again, it's on a point of order on relevance. I would ask you to direct the minister to answering the question about how many pensioners will be affected. I ask nothing else.

Sue Lines (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Ruston, as you absolutely understand, I can't put words into the minister's mouth. That's what you're asking me to do. The minister is being relevant, and I'll invite the minister to continue.

Jenny McAllister (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme) | Link to this | Hansard source

These are important changes, and they're important changes that allow investments that are necessary into the aged-care system—$3 billion will be invested in delivering more aged-care beds, delivering more packages and better care for older Australians through the 2026-27 budget prospect.

Sue Lines (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Ruston, first supplementary?

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Health and Aged Care) | Link to this | Hansard source

Private Healthcare Australia estimates couples over the age of 65 on gold cover will face up to $1,614 in additional costs from April 2027—the largest increase in private health costs on record. How does the minister expect Australian pensioners on fixed incomes to absorb that cost?

Jenny McAllister (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme) | Link to this | Hansard source

We understand that this will not be a welcome change for many people, but we also understand that the investments that we propose to secure the future of the aged-care system are important. The government has made difficult choices to ensure that we can make the investments that Australians expect, and our investments will build on the changes that we delivered in our first term that incentivise the construction of beds for aged-care residents. They will give providers the certainty that they need to build and maintain quality residential accommodation. They will make Support at Home fairer and more affordable for older Australians, and they will continue the government's work to set the aged-care system up for generations to come. People aged 65 and over currently do receive greater government subsidised discounts on their premiums than younger people on the same income. This has become a hard policy to defend. (Time expired)

Sue Lines (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Ruston, second supplementary?

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Health and Aged Care) | Link to this | Hansard source

Linda is a pensioner who is living on $29,000 a year who told ABC radio she already 'struggles like mad' to pay her private health insurance to keep herself out of emergency departments. Minister, why should Linda be forced to struggle even more just to fix Labor's budget mess? How is that fair?

Jenny McAllister (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme) | Link to this | Hansard source

It's always difficult to comment on an individual case when I don't know all of the circumstances that face Linda—

Opposition Senators:

Opposition senators interjecting—

Jenny McAllister (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme) | Link to this | Hansard source

but I will say this: all people over the age of 65 will continue—

Sue Lines (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

Minister McAllister, please resume your seat. Senator Cash and Senator Ruston, stop interjecting. I can't be clearer than that. Minister, please continue.

Jenny McAllister (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the National Disability Insurance Scheme) | Link to this | Hansard source

Under the proposed changes, all Australians will now receive the same private health support based on their income, not their age. Over-65s will still receive significant government subsidised discounts of up to 24 per cent on the premiums that private health insurers charge them, and that is the same as the rest of the population. As I indicated in my answer to your primary question, the average impact on those 65 years and older is less than a dollar a day—an average of $250 a year.