Pauline Hanson (Queensland, Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is to the Minister representing the Treasurer, Minister Gallagher. The Prime Minister promised 100 per cent renewables would deliver the cheapest form of power. The Capacity Investment Scheme is a key part of Labor's reckless energy plan that shifts the cost and risk of wind and solar onto taxpayers. Australian families and businesses are already paying soaring energy prices. If Labor are so confident this is the cheapest approach, it should be able to state the cost clearly and publicly. Can the minister please inform the Senate of the total cost of Labor's Capacity Investment Scheme in the 2025-26 budget. To assist the minister, is it within the quantified contingent liabilities?

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Foreign Affairs) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

A point of order. My recollection—I might be wrong, Senator Hanson—is that the Capacity Investment Scheme is in the climate portfolio, not the Treasury portfolio, so you would need to address your question to a different minister.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The question has been directed to Minister Gallagher.

Pauline Hanson (Queensland, Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I am addressing it to Minister Gallagher because it is to do with the Treasury and it's about the budget papers.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

That's your entitlement to do that. Minister Wong?

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Foreign Affairs) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

With respect, President, the Westminster system works on ministers who are responsible under the administrative arrangements for portfolios and agencies in their area. So it is not unreasonable for us to request that the minister who is responsible for the agency—if I'm right, and I think I am—is the minister to whom it's addressed.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

As you would be aware, Senator Wong, I've given Senator Hanson the opportunity to redirect her question. She has informed me that it is directed to Minister Gallagher. I will invite Minister Gallagher to answer the question in her capacity and in her portfolio areas. I will leave it at that, Senator Hanson.

Katy Gallagher (ACT, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the Public Service) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I am wondering, Senator Hanson, if you could repeat the last bit of your question. I couldn't hear the exact question; I heard 'contingent liabilities'.

Pauline Hanson (Queensland, Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The last part of the question is: can the minister please inform the Senate of the total cost of Labor's Capacity Investment Scheme in the 2025-26 budget. To assist the minister, is it within the quantified contingent liabilities?

Katy Gallagher (ACT, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the Public Service) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I don't have the budget papers with me, but it would be in the contingent liabilities, and it would probably also feature in the statement of risks as well, so it is fully accounted for. There is a review of the Capacity Investment Scheme currently underway, but the costs associated with it—I'm happy to come back and provide it. I don't have that document in front of me, sorry, Senator Hanson, but I'm very happy to provide that number to you. It is accounted for, and it was accounted for in MYEFO. If you talk to big emitters, it has been an important part of our response to addressing climate change, to reducing emissions and to supporting the economy as that transition occurs. It's a worldwide energy transition that's happening, and we have to respond to it. I know there are different views about that.

When we came to government, 24 out of 28 of the ageing coal-fired power stations had announced they were closing within the decade. Eight had already closed, including Hazelwood, because they were old and at the end of their life. So rebuilding the energy grid, and supporting big emitters with reducing their emissions, is a necessity. We have to provide an energy grid that works for the future, and the reality is that the infrastructure and policies we had under the former government weren't delivering that change. The government has worked across the economy to support that transition. I will come back on the exact figure. The review is underway, and the books do account for it.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Hanson, first supplementary?

Pauline Hanson (Queensland, Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Minister, I'm very happy to hear that you intend to give me those figures on the Capacity Investment Scheme, because Labor's Capacity Investment Scheme is listed in the budget papers as 'not for publication', so you are keeping the true cost of Labor's 100 per cent wind and solar energy strategy a secret from the Australian people. You've just told me you're quite happy to give me the figures—and I want those, so that's wonderful. If you're not going to come up with it in the budget papers, if it's not supposed to be for publication, why— (Time expired)

Katy Gallagher (ACT, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the Public Service) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I was trying to assist, Senator Hanson. I answered your question. It is factored into the budget. It is contained in the contingent liabilities. There is a review underway. Where figures are commercially sensitive, we can't release them, but I am happy to provide you with whatever information I can around the Capacity Investment Scheme. For example, 23 Capacity Investment Scheme agreements have been executed, with projects representing seven gigawatts of capacity, and negotiations are continuing with 33 projects. The CIS, the Capacity Investment Scheme, is delivering at least 40 gigawatts of new renewable and clean dispatchable capacity to replace capacity from the ageing and increasingly unreliable coal plants, placing downward pressure on electricity prices and helping deliver the Australian government's Renewable Energy Target by 2030.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Hanson, second supplementary?

Pauline Hanson (Queensland, Pauline Hanson's One Nation Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Minister, I'm asking you to tell us how much it's costing the taxpayers for wind, solar and batteries. That's what we have to know. Is a $50 billion, or $60 billion? How much is it costing the taxpayers? Why are you keeping it secret from the taxpayers? The taxpayers are footing the bill for this; they have a right to know. Now, you said you'd give me figures, so I'll be interested to see what figures you intend to give me.

Katy Gallagher (ACT, Australian Labor Party, Minister for the Public Service) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I am explaining to you, Senator Hanson, that I will try and provide you with whatever information I can. Where those investments are commercially sensitive or not for publication, of course that is a constraint, but I can also give you figures on what is actually happening with building the new energy system here.

This is about making sure energy remains affordable in light of the fact of our current ageing infrastructure, including those coal-fired power stations that are no longer providing the energy that we need. That's the reality. They're closing. They're ageing. They're breaking down. I remember, even just a few years ago—if you had a heatwave, people had to try and manage their electricity output. Because we have put new energy into the grid, the energy system is a lot more stable than it was.