Jessica Collins (NSW, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is to Minister Ayres, the Minister representing the Minister for Climate Change and Energy. Minister, recently ANZ CEO Mr Nuno Matos told the House of Representatives economics committee that 'some still believe net zero by 2050 is possible, but I would say at this point in time it seems difficult to reach with the current dynamics, with the current technologies, with the current public stance in many parts of the world.' He also said that 'net zero by 2050 could be the medicine that kills the patient.' Minister, do you disagree with Mr Matos's assertion that net zero by 2050 may be the medicine that kills the patient?

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

It's always good to get a question from the Chatswood-Willoughby industrial complex over there! I don't agree with Mr Matos's assertion, nor do I agree with the proposition that has been advanced in such a disorderly way towards what would happen if those opposite ever got onto the Treasury benches again—a disorderly transition. The truth is that the set of imported ideological obsessions that have driven the madness of the internal approach of those opposite is driven by an impulse for drama and social media attention and not an impulse to act in the best interests of Australians.

The problem with that wrecking impulse that is so fundamental to the identity of the Liberal and National parties today is that adopting that approach hurts ordinary Australians. It hurts ordinary Australians. It damages blue-collar jobs. It damages industry—

Jessica Collins (NSW, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

A point of order on relevance.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you, Senator Collins. I will draw the minister back to the question. Minister Ayres.

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

As I said, no, I don't agree with the proposition. I'm not sure how more relevant I could be to the question. The problem is that it is so hard to look away from the series of catastrophes that have been happening over there on the political front. The real risk to Australian living standards and to industry is the sort of arc of activity from there to over there that spells sovereign risk and disinvestment. If you want to have a look at what it would look like— (Time expired)

Jessica Collins (NSW, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Minister, last week Rio Tinto sacked 180 workers and cut production at its alumina refinery to align with Rio's decarbonisation pathway. The Orica CEO also stated that the industry cannot decarbonise with any commercial technology that exists today. Minister, Gladstone industry is shutting down to align with your government's net zero agenda while telling you this transition is not possible. Why is your government pushing a policy that is leading to workers being sacked and industry shutting down?

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator McKenzie, you have started a running commentary. You need to be silent.

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

That is—I want to frame this properly—an utterly dishonest question. If you wanted to attribute the decision that Rio Tinto, who run that facility in central Queensland, made in any way to the energy questions that all of our industry face, that is utterly inappropriate and wrong—and knowingly wrong. They made a decision at that facility—

Hon. Senators:

Honourable senators interjecting—

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I don't want to bore you with the details or the facts! They made a decision at that facility to redeploy 100 per cent—

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Ruston, on a point of order.

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Health and Aged Care) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

President, I ask you to consider whether the commentary that Senator Ayres is currently using in response to the question is adversely reflecting on an individual in this chamber.

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Foreign Affairs) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

On the point of order, I submit that it is in order to say that a question is dishonest.

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Health and Aged Care) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

On the point of order on the point of order, a question actually is an inanimate object; it's words on a piece of paper that have been put there by a person. So, to suggest that the question itself is somewhat disassociated with the person that's asking it—I'd ask you, once again, to reflect on whether that was an adverse reflection on a person.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Henderson, no. I'm responding to—

Sarah Henderson (Victoria, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

President, I'm seeking the call.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

No, Senator Henderson. I've asked you to resume your seat.

Sarah Henderson (Victoria, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I just want to speak on a point of order. I'm entitled to speak on a point of order.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Henderson, you're out of order. In response to your point of order, Senator Ruston, referring to the question itself as dishonest does not fall foul of the general custom in this place. However, I think the latter part of Senator Ayres's response was starting to go that way, so I'll remind the senator of the need to be respectful and to be careful about how he frames his response.

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

They are utterly disassociated from the reality of the decision that has been made, which is to redeploy 100 per cent of the workers involved. The decision is about investing in the future capability of that facility. That's what that is about, and it's utterly appalling to misrepresent it.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Collins, second supplementary?

Jessica Collins (NSW, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Minister, what is your message to the 185 refinery workers that have been sacked to align with your government's net zero by 2050 agenda?

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My message is to repeat what it is that I've just said. The assurances that I have been given are that those workers—

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Canavan!

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

at that facility are being redeployed from some work to other work. What it is that the company is trying to achieve is to make sure that their waste discharge—

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Canavan!

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

is stored appropriately and that they have a plan for the decades ahead to sustain their waste. It has nothing to do with their emissions and nothing to do with energy, and my message to those workers—

Matthew Canavan (Queensland, Liberal National Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I'm representing the workers; someone's got to.

Sue Lines (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Canavan, I've asked you on a number of occasions to stop interjecting. You are being disrespectful to me. Do not interject. Senator Canavan, I invite you to make a response at any other time. You have Tuesday night for open-ended adjournment if you want to make a response, not question time. Minister Ayres, please continue.

Tim Ayres (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Industry and Innovation) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My message to those workers is: work with your unions, work with the local community, work with the business and work with the federal government, which backs you and future investment in your sector—not with the show that caused so much damage over the last decade. (Time expired)