James McGrath Queensland, Liberal National Party, Shadow Assistant Minister to the Leader of the Opposition
2:42 pm
My question is to the Minister representing the Prime Minister, Senator Farrell. Minister, what does the Albanese Labor government define as mortgage stress?
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
Thank you, Senator McGrath, for your question. This government understands the pressure that ordinary working Australians are under in terms of their mortgage, and that's especially so since the decision of the independent Reserve Bank to increase interest rates by 25 basis points yesterday. What this government is trying to do is to help those people out by putting downward pressure on interest rates. I can only say it so many times, Senator McGrath, but the reality is that the fact that we were able to deliver the first budget surplus in 15 years is one of the ways in which we are trying to help—
James McGrath Queensland, Liberal National Party, Shadow Assistant Minister to the Leader of the Opposition
It's on direct relevance. The question was very specifically about how the Albanese Labor government defines mortgage stress. The minister has not gone anywhere near the definition of mortgage stress. I'd ask you to draw him back to the question.
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
Well, I will go there, because we do understand that Australians have—
Senator Ruston interjecting—
Sue Lines President
Senator Ruston, those constant interjections are disorderly. I just had Senator McGrath on his feet asking me to direct the minister to the question, which I did do. But you know that your interjections can also be something the minister responds to. So you can't have it both ways, and I've asked you to discontinue interjecting.
Simon Birmingham SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Foreign Affairs
She's giving you some time, Don!
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
With all due respect, Senator Birmingham, I don't need time. I understand—
Michaelia Cash WA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations
What percentage of your income to do you spend on your mortgage?
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
You keep—
I do answer your questions. You may not like the way I answer your questions.
Sue Lines President
Minister Farrell, please resume your seat. Order across the chamber!
Senator Cash, I just called order. That includes you. Senator Birmingham, on a point of order?
Simon Birmingham SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Foreign Affairs
I rise on a point of order on direct relevance. Yes, interjections may occur in the chamber. I, as a minister, answered plenty of questions with interjections occurring across the chamber. You still answer the question. If it would help the minister, perhaps he can read the highlighted words from Wayne Swan, 'Mortgage stress is when household are paying more than 30 per cent of their income.' Try reading it out, Don.
Sue Lines President
Order! Senator Birmingham, stunts are also out of order. I have directed the minister to the question. Senator Birmingham, I'm responding to your point of order. What you did as a minister was your choice. If there are interjections, ministers can choose to ignore them, as obviously you did, or they can choose to answer them. The chamber nevertheless should be listening in silence. Senator O'Neill.
Deborah O'Neill NSW, Australian Labor Party
President, just in light of the way in which the Senate has—
Deborah O'Neill NSW, Australian Labor Party
I rise on a point of order because there's been debate about standards today. My point of order goes to the standard of making a speech about standards and then physically throwing a document across the table. It's inappropriate. The senator should apologise.
Sue Lines President
Order across the chamber! Senator O'Neill, you are not running this chamber; I am. I have addressed that issue. There was not a point of order there. I'm going back to Senator Farrell and ask him to direct his answer to the question.
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
If you want to answer your own questions then why bother to ask me the questions?
James McGrath Queensland, Liberal National Party, Shadow Assistant Minister to the Leader of the Opposition
2:47 pm
Minister, how many Australian households are currently experiencing mortgage stress and how many more will as a result of yet another interest rate increase under Labor?
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
I thank Senator McGrath for his first supplementary question. Look, I don't think I can make it any clearer than I have already made it. We understand that—
Sue Lines President
Minister Farrell, please resume your seat. Senator Scarr, I would ask you to withdraw that personal reflection.
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
I actually didn't hear it but thank you for—
Bridget McKenzie Victoria, National Party, Shadow Minister for Infrastructure, Transport and Regional Development
Turn up your hearing aids.
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
Oh, give us a break. Look, we do understand the pressure that ordinary Australians are under as a result of these rising interest rates. If you hadn't mismanaged the economy so badly, so badly, under the nine years that you were part of the former—
James McGrath Queensland, Liberal National Party, Shadow Assistant Minister to the Leader of the Opposition
I rise on a point of order on direct relevance. The question was very tightly written. It goes to how many households are currently experiencing mortgage stress. It's asking for a number. The minister is not going near the question. I ask you to direct him back to the question, please.
Sue Lines President
I will direct the minister to the question. Minister.
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
Well, I can only reiterate time and time again we understand the problem of higher interest rates. We understand the problem. We're seeking to do things in the economy that we have control of— (Time expired)
James McGrath Queensland, Liberal National Party, Shadow Assistant Minister to the Leader of the Opposition
2:49 pm
Does the Albanese Labor government accept responsibility for increasing mortgage stress, and will it apologise to those Australian households?
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
I think it's worthwhile to note that, of course, the Reserve Bank is an independent organisation in this country. It was an independent organisation when you were in government, and it's an independent organisation when we are in government, and we aren't proposing to change that situation. The decisions that they make are the decisions of an independent organisation. They are not in the control—
James McGrath Queensland, Liberal National Party, Shadow Assistant Minister to the Leader of the Opposition
I'm reluctant to do this, but I raise a point of order on direct relevance. The question once again was very tightly written and asked whether the government accepted responsibility and whether it would apologise. I ask if you could direct the minister back to answering the question, particularly in relation to the apology.
Sue Lines President
I think in that regard the minister is being directly relevant, because he's made reference to other bodies that are responsible.
Simon Birmingham SA, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Foreign Affairs
On this occasion the answer does speak volumes: they accept no responsibility.
Don Farrell SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Trade and Tourism
I'm not sure what's got into Senator Birmingham today, but he is now interrupting constantly in respect of every answer that I give. I don't know— (Time expired)