Carol Brown (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Assistant Minister for Infrastructure and Regional Tourism) | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is to the Minister for Families and Social Services, Senator Ruston. The government recently promised pensioners a boost of up to $800. How many pensioner couples out of Australia's 2.5 million pensioners will actually get anything like $800?

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Families and Social Services) | Link to this | Hansard source

I thank Senator Brown for her question in relation to deeming rates. The government was pleased to make an announcement on 14 July about reducing deeming rates so that they were brought more in line with the kinds of returns that retirees and self-funded and partial pensioners were receiving on the suite of investments and financial assets that they had available to them.

As I said at the announcement, it would range for people—up to $1,053 for couples and $804 for singles each year. That would be the amount for somebody who was on the maximum amount of deeming before they were no longer eligible for the aged pension. So right the way through the whole spectrum, from getting just $1 right the way through to singles getting $804 and couples getting $1,053, there are nearly a million Australians who benefit by the reduction in the deeming rates. That reduction actually is about to take effect now and is backdated to 1 July. Our pensioners who are affected by deeming will actually feel the benefit of that when they get their—

Carol Brown (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Assistant Minister for Infrastructure and Regional Tourism) | Link to this | Hansard source

A point of order on relevance: my question was very clear. I appreciate the information that the minister has told the Senate, but the question is: how many, out of Australia's 2.5 million pensioners, will actually get anything like $800?

Scott Ryan (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

I cannot instruct the minister how to answer a question. The minister is talking directly about the subject matter of the question. I believe she's being directly relevant. There was in the minister's answer, only shortly before your point of order, an observation about numbers of people, but I can't instruct the minister how to answer a question. I believe the minister in this case is being directly relevant. Senator Wong, on a point of order?

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) | Link to this | Hansard source

On the point of order: whilst that is the case, you can remind the minister of the question in appropriate circumstances, and I note that you have done so previously.

Scott Ryan (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Brown has reminded the minister of the nature of her question. In this case I believe the minister is being directly relevant. I've given the senator an opportunity to restate the question.

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Families and Social Services) | Link to this | Hansard source

Of the over 2.5 million Australians who are pensioners, about 900,000 of that 2.5-plus million pensioners will actually be impacted on deeming within the spectrum of the rates that I've said. What I would also say, for those opposite as an explanation about how deeming rates actually work, is that they actually work at a point in time. People's financial assets often will change from time to time, so from one fortnight to the next fortnight there could be a different number of people who would be impacted to the maximum amount or a different amount. So there is no one particular answer that you're able to give. What I will say is that there is a spectrum from $1 to $804 and people will fall within that.

Scott Ryan (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Brown, a supplementary question?

Carol Brown (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Assistant Minister for Infrastructure and Regional Tourism) | Link to this | Hansard source

Can the minister confirm that of the 2.5 million pensioner couples less than one per cent will receive $800? How can the minister expect any pensioner to trust this government?

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Families and Social Services) | Link to this | Hansard source

I can assure you that the pensioners of Australia obviously did trust this government, because they voted us back in. What they did was look at what we were offering pensioners and what our policies were in regard to older Australians, and they made a decision that they wanted us to look after their interests for the next three years. We're delighted to be able to do that because we believe our older Australians deserve the kind of support that the Morrison government is prepared to give them. We did not go to the election with a suite of taxation measures that included taxing their retirement savings. What we went to the election with was a suite of measures that said to older Australians that we would look after them.

I would just like to draw to the attention of those opposite that if they don't understand the difference between 'up to' and actually stating a number, then obviously they don't read my press releases very closely. At no time— (Time expired)

Scott Ryan (President) | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Brown, a final supplementary question?

Carol Brown (Tasmania, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Assistant Minister for Infrastructure and Regional Tourism) | Link to this | Hansard source

Despite the minister's office telling media that no such data existed, documents released under FOI have revealed that less than one per cent of pensioner couples will receive the full $800. Why did the minister's office mislead the media? What was the government so ashamed of that the minister's office was trying to hide the facts?

Anne Ruston (SA, Liberal Party, Minister for Families and Social Services) | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you, Senator Brown, for your follow-up question. At no time was the information that you're referring to ever provided to my office. Subsequent to a request from the media, we sought from the department the collated information to which you are referring. That information was collated and subsequently provided to the journalist that asked for it. So I don't think there's anything to see here, apart from a group of older Australians who chose to vote in this government to look after their interests.

If you'd like me to talk about deeming rates I can talk for hours about deeming rates, because I understand clearly that 900,000 Australians are benefiting from the reduction in the deeming rate—they will actually benefit in the forthcoming week—not only because their deeming rate will reduce the amount they are deemed to have earned in this particular period but because they will also get three months of the reduced deeming rate as a back payment in their next payment. So for the 900,000— (Time expired)