Chris Ketter (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

My question is to Senator Cormann, the Minister representing the Treasurer. I refer to reports in The Australian that the Prime Minister has ordered Treasury to include second round effects modelling in costings for the innovation statement. Is this true?

Senator Conroy interjecting—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order on my left.

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

You are in that much trouble. You are going to dodgy up the numbers—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Conroy—

Cory Bernardi (SA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

You know about dodgying up the numbers, Senator Conroy.

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

and Senator Bernardi.

Honourable senators interjecting—

Order!

Doug Cameron (NSW, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Minister for Human Services) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

You would have liked to have dodgied up the numbers against Malcolm, but you couldn't!

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Cameron.

Senator Ian Macdonald interjecting—

Senator Macdonald.

Honourable senators interjecting—

Order! Senator Macdonald!

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I have told the senator before that he should not believe everything he reads in the newspaper. Of course, the next budget update, as with every budget and budget update that we have provided in the past, will be prepared consistent with the provisions of the Charter of Budget Honesty.

Senator Conroy interjecting—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order!

Chris Ketter (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I have a supplementary question. Can the minister confirm that the Charter of Budget Honesty costing guidelines requires the departments of Treasury and Finance to take into account first round effects only and will generally not incorporate second-round effects? Will the costing of the innovation statement include second-round effects?

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I have, in fact, already answered that question.

Kim Carr (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Shadow Minister Assisting the Leader for Science) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

No, you didn't.

Opposition senators interjecting—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order!

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

For the avoidance of any doubt, of course, the Mid-Year Economic and Fiscal Outlook as a budget update, like every budget and budget update we have provided—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Pause the clock. Point of order, Senator Wong?

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The question was, 'Will the costing of the innovation statement include second-round effects?'

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

In fairness to the minister, we need to give him a bit more time. He is only 15 seconds into his answer. Senator Wong?

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

There is no reference to MYEFO in the question. How can it possibly be relevant to this question?

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I am going to give the minister a little bit more time to respond. Minister.

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

No wonder that Senator Wong was the worst finance minister in the history of the Commonwealth. No wonder that she was the worst finance minister—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order! Minister!

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

in the history of the Commonwealth.

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Minister!

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

She does not even know—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order!

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

that an innovation statement would be reflected—

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Cormann!

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

in the Mid-Year Economic and Fiscal Outlook.

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Cormann.

Stephen Conroy (Victoria, Australian Labor Party, Deputy Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Dear, oh dear!

Opposition senators interjecting —

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order on my left! Minister, I did give you the good grace of allowing you to respond, and I think you abused the good grace I gave you. But I will call you to order and to answer the question.

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

The question related to the Charter of Budget Honesty. The only way that question can be relevant is in the context of how the innovation statement, as any other policy measure of the government, is costed in the context of budgets and budget updates. It was directly relevant, and the fact that the good senator on the opposition side does not get this point, the fact that she made the point of order she made, shows how little she understands—

Senator Wong interjecting—

I have already indicated that all of these policy measures— (Time expired)

Chris Ketter (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr President, I ask a further supplementary question. Doesn't the Prime Minister's extraordinary intervention show that this government is cooking the books in order to mask the fact that the innovation statement will be an additional hit on the bottom line in the government's December budget update?

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I completely reject the premise of the question—No. 1. No. 2, the answer that I gave to the primary question was that we would be costing—

Penny Wong (SA, Australian Labor Party, Leader of the Opposition in the Senate) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Why does Christopher Pyne get a leave pass?

Ian Macdonald (Queensland, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Can you keep quiet for five seconds, Senator Wong?

Stephen Parry (President) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Order on both sides! Senator Macdonald and Senator Wong!

Mathias Cormann (WA, Liberal Party, Minister for Finance) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

As I have indicated in answer to the primary question, costings for this measure, as for any other measure in MYEFO, as in every budget and budget update so far, will be done consistent with the requirements of the Charter of Budget Honesty. The assertions that Senator Ketter and Senator Wong have been making are false. Of course we will be preparing costings for the innovation statement, as for any other budget measure, consistent with the requirements in the Charter of Budget Honesty.