Michael Ronaldson Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Veterans' Affairs
2:15 pm
You won't be quite as chirpy—
John Hogg President
Order! You are entitled to be heard in silence, Senator Ronaldson
It is disorderly, Senator Conroy, to keep interjecting.
Michael Ronaldson Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Veterans' Affairs
As I said, you won't be quite as chirpy in a second, my friend. My question is to the Minister representing the Treasurer, Senator Wong. Can the minister confirm that the latest Treasury budget analysis—
Government senators interjecting—
John Hogg President
Order! Senator Ronaldson, I go back to where we started. You are entitled to be heard—
Government senators interjecting—
On my right! Senator Ronaldson is entitled to be heard in silence. Senator Ronaldson, continue.
Michael Ronaldson Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Veterans' Affairs
I will start again, Mr President, so that there is no doubt about the question.
Michael Ronaldson Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Veterans' Affairs
Thank you. Can the minister—that is, Senator Wong—confirm that the latest Treasury budget analysis shows that the government is heading for cumulative deficits of $100 billion over the forward estimates, on the back of declining commodity prices and in addition to the government's $120 billion budget black hole?
Penny Wong SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Finance and Deregulation
2:17 pm
I am not sure what that question actually was, because I think the question was that the latest Treasury estimates—
Unidentified interjection - Hansard doesn't record who said this
Opposition Senators:
Opposition senators interjecting—
Penny Wong SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Finance and Deregulation
Thank you. The senator referred to the latest Treasury estimates. The latest Treasury figures are the published budget figures, which do not include the figures that I think the senator was referring to. I remind him that, in terms of Australia's position, our public finances are in very strong shape. As I have said previously, during the break I had the opportunity to go to the APEC finance ministers' meeting, representing the Treasurer, and also to Washington prior to that, and it really did bring home to me how well Australia is doing on many fronts, certainly in terms of our growth figures, our unemployment figures and our investment figures.
Eric Abetz Tasmania, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations
Self-praise is no praise.
Penny Wong SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Finance and Deregulation
This is something of which the country can be proud, Senator Abetz, of which the nation can be proud. We have come through a very volatile period of the global economy in a very good position. In terms of our public finances, Australia's net debt position peaks at about 9.2 per cent of GDP. The equivalent position for the United States is 83.7 per cent.
Michael Ronaldson Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Veterans' Affairs
Mr President, I raise a point of order on relevance. I asked the minister whether we are or are not heading for cumulative deficits of $100 billion over the forward estimates. It was a quite clear question. Yes or no?
John Hogg President
The minister has 27 seconds remaining to answer the question. I do draw the minister's attention to the question.
Senator Cormann interjecting—
Penny Wong SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Finance and Deregulation
In reality I think Senator Cormann should have asked this question. The reality is that the forward estimates project an underlying cash position of $1.5 billion in 2012-13; $2 billion in 2013-14; and $5.3 billion in 2014-15 et cetera, which are the figures that the government has published. They will be updated in the usual way in the MYEFO.
Michael Ronaldson Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Veterans' Affairs
2:19 pm
Mr President, I ask a supplementary question. I know when the arms are crossed that we are getting through. Can the minister confirm that the latest Treasury analysis shows that, on current numbers, the government will deliver a $25 billion deficit this financial year, not the wafer thin surplus as promised?
Penny Wong SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Finance and Deregulation
2:20 pm
Mr President, I refer to my first answer in response to that. I have no idea on what basis Senator Ronaldson is creating a range of figures to put to me. This perhaps is the same approach that we see from the coalition time and time again, the people who use catering companies to do their costing—
George Brandis Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Attorney-General
That's rubbish, Penny.
Penny Wong SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Finance and Deregulation
It is not rubbish. It is what you did. These are the people who use accountants who have been found to have acted unprofessionally and the people who refuse to comply with the Charter of Budget Honesty because they do not want Australians to know what they are planning. But I tell you what: Premier Newman has shown precisely what their plans are, because the $70 billion that they have to find, if they ever get into government, we know will end up with job cuts. (Time expired)
Michael Ronaldson Victoria, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Veterans' Affairs
2:21 pm
Mr President, I ask a further supplementary question, and there is still no denial in relation to those figures. Why should anyone believe that the government would do better this year than last year when Labor's budget deficit for 2011-12 deteriorated from a projected $10 billion in 2010 to $44.4 billion in 2012?
Penny Wong SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Finance and Deregulation
2:22 pm
What is always astonishing in this place—
Unidentified interjection - Hansard doesn't record who said this
Opposition Senators:
Opposition senators interjecting—
John Hogg President
Senator Wong, resume your seat. If you wish to debate it, the time to debate it is after question time, not now!
Senator Cormann interjecting—
Order!
Penny Wong SA, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Finance and Deregulation
As I was saying, what is astonishing about the coalition is that not only do they completely ignore any requirement for costings, any requirement to comply with Peter Costello's charter of budget honesty, not only do they continue to want to use auditors who have acted unprofessionally and catering companies to do their costings—because they want to hide from the Australian people what their plans really are—but they always act as if the global financial crisis never occurred. They always act as if revenue has never changed, as if the global economy has never experienced its worst period since the Great Depression, and they always want to talk down the Australian economy which has come through this period of weakness and volatility internationally in far better shape than any other country, and I am actually very proud of that. (Time expired)