Ian Macdonald (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Northern and Remote Australia) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I move:

That the Senate take note of answers given by ministers to questions without notice asked by opposition senators today.

Can I be the first in this chamber who actually voted for you to congratulate you on your accession to the Deputy President's role?

Stephen Parry (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you.

Ian Macdonald (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Northern and Remote Australia) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

We have a new Senate but we have the same, old, incompetent, tired, dishonest and wasteful government before us. You only have to look at the ministers who answered questions today at question time to understand what abject and unmitigated failures they are as ministers, and consequently that incompet­ence shows on the government of the day.

We had Senator Ludwig telling us about the live cattle export ban. Every Australian can see that, as a result of Senator Ludwig's incompetence, Australia has lost a very fine industry, the cattle industry, employing many thousands of Northern Australians, including Indigenous Australians. We had Senator Arbib telling us how he is making make-work programs for Indigenous stockmen and Indigenous workers whilst at the same time Senator Ludwig is destroying their jobs and their livelihoods with his incompetent decision on live cattle export.

We also had Senator Conroy answering questions and demonstrating again how he and his government promised that the government would spend $4.7 billion on a national broadband network and how that has now grown to some $55 billion.

We also had a failed Minister for Climate Change and Energy Efficiency trying to in some way exculpate the government from the mess it has created with its various climate change policies. On Friday the heads of Ford and Holden in Australia indicated that, as a result of the carbon tax, the saleroom cost of a Holden Commodore or any basic-model Australian-built car would increase by some $1,000 and the cost of production of Australian cars would increase by something like $40 million to $50 million. As the head of Holden Australia said, this sort of new tax on the manufacturing industry in Australia will cause them to 'reassess' their manufacturing presence in Australia. This is what the Labor Party's carbon tax will do. It will not do anything for reducing greenhouse gas emissions; it will simply send offshore Australian jobs, and those manufacturing industries will be working in countries with far less stringent limits on greenhouse gas emissions than the Australian nation has.

The failure of the current and past climate change ministers was easily determined by today's question time. This is the whole problem with the Australian Labor Party. There will be no appreciable benefit what­soever to reduction of greenhouse gas emissions because all of the jobs that create them will go offshore. We have heard today that fuel is going to be exempt from carbon tax. So what is going to happen to green­house gas emissions? They are not going to reduce at all, and we all know that the transport industry is one of the biggest emitters of greenhouse gases.

So the government is all over the place. They are putting on this huge tax for measures which will not reduce the emissions from Australia; what they will do is send jobs offshore. The minister and the government are afraid to answer questions on what the addition of the carbon tax will do to the cost of production of Australian vehicles. The minister said she did not know about it. Well, she has a very poor department if they did not alert her to the very widespread news article that appeared last Friday. The car industries are definitely worried about their future in Australia, all because of this government's carbon tax proposals. One wonders what the workers so-called 'friends', the Labor Party, are doing to try and save those jobs in Australia.

Trish Crossin (NT, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Can I also add my congratulations to you, Mr Deputy President, in obtaining this position today. One regret is, though, that we have lost you from the Senate Legal and Constitutional Committee. We know you will look kindly on that committee in your deliberations in this role. Congratulations.

I rise also to provide a contribution today to this debate to take note of answers. I want to re-emphasise the answers given by Senator Ludwig. As a senator for the Northern Territory, I know only too well the importance of the live cattle industry to people in the Northern Territory. I also know the benefit, of course, that that live cattle trade provides to our economy in the Northern Territory and also nationally.

I want to reiterate that there are a number of us who are diligently working with the live cattle industry, particularly the Northern Territory Cattlemen's Association, to resolve this issue as quickly as possible. Despite the calls around the country to totally ban live cattle export, this government will not do that. This government has not said that it will take that stance at all; in fact, this govern­ment is working constantly, hour by hour, to deliver an outcome as quickly as possible, to again get the cattle moving and on those boats and off to Indonesia.

We have had the Prime Minister in the Northern Territory twice in one month to meet with the cattle industry to talk through with them their issues and concerns. On Wednesday last week, in fact, she spent quite a bit of time with them. As a result of that, we announced a further Live Exports Assistance Package of $30 million. That was done in consultation with that industry.

I and Minister Warren Snowdon from the House organised for the Northern Territory Cattlemen's Association executive to meet here in Parliament House for two days. That occurred only a fortnight ago. It was unprecedented for an association such as that to have access to ministers and people from the opposition, and people from any caucus, for 48 hours to talk through and highlight their concerns about what they were going through and experiencing.

But, as we have said on record, we want to ensure that, when the cattle leave this country on the boats and get to Indonesia, the welfare of those animals, to the extent that we saw on that Four Corners program, is resolved forever. We do not want just a stopgap solution to get the current cattle moving but not fix up the problem in the long term. We want to ensure that the problems that have been highlighted are resolved definitely and forever and that we never, ever have this problem recur.

We are trying to resolve this issue as quickly as possible. The Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry, Senator Ludwig, travelled to Indonesia to talk this through and a range of people are working on this constantly. We have talked through with the Indonesian government some pro­visions which we believe will improve what is happening in abattoirs and improve the control and regulation of the supply chain. We also have an industry-government working group on live animal exports which was established in June. The new system may include placing controls on Australian exporters' licences. Such controls would require that exporters demonstrate they are supplying animals into a supply chain that meets agreed animal welfare standards. The exporter would also have to fulfil all other export requirements.

We have to ensure that when those animals arrive in Indonesia we work with the Indonesian government cooperatively—not dictating to the government but respecting the policies and the wishes of that govern­ment—so that as quickly as possible the cattle are placed in feedlots that are well controlled, well organised and supervised and after leaving those feedlots they go to an abattoir which meets the expectations that Australians require. We are the only country at this stage demanding that of Indonesia. It is another country. You need to respect the rights and the protocols of that country. It is not for us to simply take over and dictate to that country what it ought to do. This government is working hard to resolve this. (Time expired)

Stephen Parry (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Senator Crossin, I thank you for your kind remarks.

Christopher Back (WA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr Deputy President, I add my congratulations on your election. All of the points made by Senator Crossin in the last couple of minutes are admirable. What a shame they were not actually undertaken prior to 8 June when the decision was taken by the Minister for Agriculture, Fisheries and Forestry to suspend trade completely.

The simple fact of the matter is that the minister is correct in the points he makes about animal welfare and all of its issues. Anybody who saw the footage on the ABC was shocked at the cruelty et cetera—there is not a person in Australia who was not—and action had to be taken. He was correct in the action he took initially, which was to suspend trade with those abattoirs that did not meet standards. Unfortunately, there were already a number of abattoirs that did—and still do—meet international standards, including those to which 1,900 cattle were sent from Port Hedland on 6 June, two days before the ban was imposed, by Elders and which were to go to Elders' own feedlot and then their own internationally acclaimed abattoir. We now have a total abrogation of any capacity on the part of Australia to control or have any say in this industry.

The minister is well aware, as are others, that Minister Suswono, the Indonesian Minister for Agriculture, was deeply insulted as a result of the suspension without any consultation. The minister made a point in answer to my question about supply chain assurance. All he need have done was to consult with people in the industry—exporters, me and others who offered that opportunity—and the whole question of the integrity of the meat chain from station to port, from port to feedlot and from feedlot to abattoirs could have been well and truly and easily handled by consultation in advance. He is correct about traceability, transparency and independent auditing. I was the one who suggested that veterinarians well versed in abattoir management after many years in Australia would have been the appropriate people to have undertaken that independent auditing.

The coalition offered the minister all the support it could prior to the time in which he made the decision, but once the door is closed it is only the Indonesians who can open it. Today they made a decision that they are not going to issue any more import licences until the end of September. For those who are not familiar with the cattle industry in the north of Australia, that could effectively be the end of the trade. If we get an early break to the season and we get the summer rains in September-October, there will be no mustering of cattle, there will be no trucking of cattle, there will be no trade beyond September.

Animal welfare issues, of course, are critically important. So are the hundreds of thousands of cattle on the rangelands. Those cattle that are now too heavy to go to Indonesia will not go to Indonesia. The mothers from last year's calving will be calving again this year, so we will have three generations—cows, this year's calves and last year's calves—that should be in feedlots or in abattoirs in Indonesia right now. We are facing an animal welfare disaster. Should we have a light summer rain this coming summer, this time next year we will have hundreds of thousands of animals facing starvation and we will have a natural environment that will be decimated. This could have been avoided.

We already have an animal welfare issue in Indonesia where cattle are on trucks for up to four days to try and meet the supply in advance of Ramadan, which is now 26 days away, the period of the biggest consumption of red meat in the year. Others have asked why cattle cannot come to the south for a southern winter. They are too light to be slaughtered in the south. It would be an animal welfare disaster to bring Bos indicus cattle down to the southern winter and try to fatten them at this time of the year.

I asked a question about the welfare and wellbeing of not only the pastoralists in the north but also all those who rely on the industry. We have a circumstance in which $30 million has been offered. The $30 million would have been far better spent in Indonesia with the Indonesians upgrading Indonesian abattoirs so that they would meet the correct standards that the minister has identified, OIE standards. We do not want handouts. What we want is support to get this trade going again. The effect across the north is catastrophic. The risk to this country if the Indonesians decide to buy live cattle and buffalo from India which is rife with foot-and-mouth disease is incredible. The risk to animal welfare in this country should ever we get foot-and-mouth disease would be on a scale never contemplated. (Time expired)

Mark Furner (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Mr Deputy President, I join with other Senate colleagues in congratulating you on your appointment today.

Stephen Parry (Tasmania, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you.

Mark Furner (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

It is a fine choice and it is good to see you in the chair. I wish to respond to the motion to take note of answers provided by Senator Ludwig to questions on the live export issue. It was a decision that was not taken harshly; it was a decision that was taken with concern for the welfare of and impact on the industry. I am certain that you would be aware, Mr Deputy President, that we do not take these decisions on the spur of the moment, whether on the issues associated with Four Corners or on others. We looked at the concerns of this industry in the approach that has been taken. I remind senators opposite that this is a matter that has been raised with the industry, with Meat and Livestock Australia, since January of this year. The minister actually wrote to that association, expressing concerns about this particular animal welfare issue of the method of slaughter in Indonesia.

Again, we do not take these decisions lightly and we do not take them with the degree that people think we might—certainly those opposite. I think Senator Macdonald made the claim—the wild accusation—that we have lost a fine industry. That is typical of this scare campaign that they consistently run. Whether it be on carbon pricing or on other mechanisms, they run this scare campaign—

Ian Macdonald (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Northern and Remote Australia) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Have you ever been up into the Gulf Country?

Mark Furner (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Yes, I have been to Indonesia.

Ian Macdonald (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Northern and Remote Australia) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Not to Indonesia—to the Gulf Country!

Mark Furner (Queensland, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

I have been up north, as a Queensland senator, and have been involved in the cattle industry, so I am well aware of what happens in abattoirs and I am well aware of what happens in Indonesia. I have not been to an Indonesian abattoir but I am aware of the customs and the culture there, and I do have an appreciation of why this is an issue. That is why we need to work through this particular problem and get a resolution in the mechanisms and measures that we are taking, whilst taking into con­sidera­tion the welfare of those animals and at the same time taking into consideration the welfare of the industry.

We also have an obligation under World Trade Organisation rules to take action to ensure that Australian cattle are treated in accordance with those standards on animal welfare. Hand in hand with that particular requirement and obligation, we are also supporting the industry in terms of a contingency fund of $5 million for assistance to workers. That is why we are involved in trying to find a resolution and provide assistance for the industry and workers up in the cape, the Territory and other northern parts of Western Australia. It is another example of what we have done in times of need when people have been seeking assistance from this government. If we reflect back on the Queensland floods and cyclone, the government was there. We provided assistance for workers and for people who were affected by those particular terrible incidents. From memory, I think that those opposite opposed the flood levy. They were not interested in assisting people who were in a time of need. I do not know what their position is on this issue; they seem to be lost in some respects.

It is a case of a fine balance between working with the industry and working with the Indonesian government. That is why the minister has been up there and has consulted and discussed it with his Indonesian counterpart. We also have the Minister for Foreign Affairs, Kevin Rudd, who is willing to have some dialogue with the government of Indonesia. One thing that we have been able to do with the Indonesian government, since we have a healthy relationship with them, is to come up with solutions and outcomes that are suitable for both countries. It was not that long ago that we welcomed the Indonesian president to the House, and I think that the dialogue and communication, the understanding and respect for one another and the healthy relationship between the two governments was demonstrated by each government on the floor on that occasion. That healthy relationship will continue with our involvement in this particular issue.

So it is not a case of the industry being destroyed or being lost, as stated in the scare campaign that is being run by some of those opposite. It is not all of them; I take on board some of the comments made by Senator Back. He comes from a veterinary backg­round, so he understands the reasons for this and the issues associated with animal welfare in this particular area. I think that, if more people like Senator Back had come forward and expressed the concerns of this industry, we would be in a position of reaching a solution. (Time expired)

Mary Fisher (SA, Liberal Party) Share this | Link to this | Hansard source

Thank you and congratulations, Mr Deputy President. I rise to take note of answers given by Senator Ludwig today and to commiserate with Senator Furner on the crocodile tears that he has shed and that his colleagues are shedding as to the state of the cattle industry in Australia. Crocodile tears are all they are. This is a government that has been cowed into submission. It has been cowed into suspending our live cattle trade with Indonesia—cowed into a blanket suspension that is all pain for no gain. It is all pain for Indonesian cattle, which continue to be slaughtered daily in Indonesian abattoirs. It is all pain for the Indonesians themselves, who have a government that is clearly miffed.

The Australian Labor Party are trying to suggest that they are working with the Indonesian government. The Indonesian government are clearly miffed at the lack of consultation prior to the blanket banning of trade with their country. They are so clearly miffed that they have today announced that there will be no more import licences for three months. It is all pain and no gain. What about Australian cattle? As my colleague Senator Back has mentioned, Bos indicus cattle coming down from the north to the south aren't gonna put on any condition if they are trucked south. And every time you handle cattle—every time you handle any animal—you risk stressing them? What about the carbon miles in transporting cattle from the north down to the south or to the west?

As for the compensation that has recently been announced by the government to the industry of $30 million plus some $5 million plus some Centrelink payments—please! How offensive. And what a waste, because the only reason the government is even having to contemplate making those payments is that it is in the process of trashing our live export trade and, in particular, our cattle trade to Indonesia. What a waste, and how offensive. All that the industry wants is its trade back up to those abattoirs in Indonesia which we know treat our cattle humanely. So whose bidding is the Australian Labor Party really doing? Is it the bidding of the Australian Greens? How low will this government stoop? Will it support the Australian Greens' bill to ban live exports, writ large? Is that how low this Australian government will go? Alternatively, will it stoop so low as to adopt the policy of the New South Wales Greens, who in May 2010, according to their website—I am sure Senator Rhiannon can talk more about this—considered it environ­mentally essential to decrease production of animals for food and other products? Australian Labor Party, do you know about this? Is this how low you are going to stoop? The Labor Party may be in government, but they know that the Greens are in power.

What is Senator Brown's position on the New South Wales Greens' policy? Has he had a discussion with Senator Rhiannon about it yet? While we are at it, how extensively do the Greens consult with their constituents and their supporters? For my part, in this Parliament House today is my aunt, once an Independent senator—and a very good Independent senator, although quite some political policies apart from me—for Western Australia, Jo Vallentine. Former Senator Vallentine is here. Is it for me being sworn in? No. I wish she were here to support me, but she is here to support the nine Greens senators sworn in today, which I find a bit tragic. But former Senator Vallentine and I grew up in the same farm­house in Western Australia. I cannot believe that former Senator Vallentine, as a stalwart of the Greens, would really support decreasing production of animals for food and other animal products. (Time expired)

Question agreed to.