Ian Macdonald (Queensland, Liberal Party, Shadow Parliamentary Secretary for Northern and Remote Australia) Share this | Hansard source

We agree on that, Senator McLucas—one of the few things we agree on. But I can read the graph. It goes like this: sea level there; a fall down to there; and 20,000 years ago it went straight up like that. What caused that? Human beings' industrialisation? I do not know. Ask the CSIRO. In fact, I have asked them in a question on notice. I am still waiting for the response. So this is the sort of campaign that is being run by Labor and the Greens and this is what will happen.

As I say, I do not presume to lecture other people on things like science; I have always been quite clear on that. Of course climate is changing—there is never any doubt about that in my mind. Is man doing it? I do not know. I have been open about that. I have heard a lot of scientists say it is; I have heard a lot of scientists say it is not. If they cannot agree, what chance have I got? So my position has never changed.

But what I do say is: why do you penalise Australians with this sort of ridiculous, job-destroying carbon tax when nobody else in the world is doing it? I would hope someone in the Labor Party might get up and quote us the figures from the United States—'Well, there are lots of states doing it.' If they read recent history, they will find that most of the states in the United States that used to do something like this are withdrawing and getting out of it as quickly as possible, because these carbon trading schemes are a farce. The United States congress has made it quite clear that they will not be having one bar of any emissions trading scheme or carbon tax. The Chinese are often quoted, but even the government and, I suspect, Senator Brown, now have to acknowledge that, while the Chinese people are reducing their output of carbon by certain means, at the same time they are building new coal-fired power stations every day, so that the net result for China will be continuing increases in carbon.

What will this tax do for Australians? It will increase their cost of living, particularly for those of us who live remote from the capital cities. Of course, I know the Labor Party and the Greens are not interested in that; they do not get any support out in the real world. You have only to look at the fiasco on live cattle to understand that they have no interest in, no empathy for and no understanding of the human lives—let alone the businesses and family histories—being put at risk by things like the live cattle ban. As an aside, I say that thankfully Senator Ludwig has at last, after three weeks, woken up to what destruction he had done with that stupid decision. But it is typical of the Labor government to rush in and make a decision on pink batts, live cattle or school halls. They rush in, make a decision and waste all the taxpayers' money. It is not their money. I tell you that, if it were the Labor Party's money they were spending on these schemes, they would be a bit more careful; but it is the taxpayers' money. They do not care about the taxpayers' money. It is very easy to spend other people's money, and that is what the Labor Party are doing.

So, come Sunday, we are going to learn how the carbon tax is going to impact on us all. Today's leak was that it is not going to be 1,000 companies that pay; it is going to be only 500. How are they going to get to their targets? I would be interested to have Senator Brown tell me how they are going to halve the number of people they are going to attack and yet get the same outcome. If you are going to have this tax to pay everybody everything, as Ms Gillard is presently promising—not that anyone would take any notice of anything Ms Gillard promises—where is the money going to come from if they are going to tax only half the companies they said they were going to? The hypocrisy and the lack of truthfulness involved in this debate is absolutely mind-boggling.

But there is one way to fix it up: let the people of Australia have a say. What could be fairer than that? What objection can you have to that? Senator Brown says it will cost $80 million. Some of the programs that the Greens raise every day would cost much, much more than $80 million. But you would be giving the Australian people a say in perhaps the greatest taxation issue since the GST.

I mention the GST because that is a good example of how to do things right. When we were in government, we talked about a GST. We brought in all the rules and procedures and the draft legislation. We said to the Australian public: 'This is what we are going to do with the GST; now we're going to an election, and if you think that we're on the right track then you'll vote for us and we'll form a government and be able to put in the GST. If you don't think it's the right thing, you won't vote for it.' Why can't the Gillard government do that? I will tell you why: the Labor Party and the Greens know that, if they asked the Australian public—if you were at all a believer in democracy—they would both be annihilated. The people of Australia would say, 'We don't want this tax; we don't want this imposition on our cost of living, particularly when it won't impact in any way whatsoever—it will not have one iota of impact—on the world greenhouse gas emissions. All it will do will be to send Australian jobs overseas.' I am very distraught about the jobs up in the central Queensland area, up in North Queensland and up in Northern Australia, including the Pilbara. I am very worried about the impact the tax will have on the jobs of my fellow Australians. The Labor Party and the Greens do not care about that. They just want a tax. They want to get the money in. They have huge budget black holes. They will do anything to try to overcome their incompet­ence with money.

So I conclude by again asking Senator Brown or any of the Labor Party people who are prepared to discuss this particular bill: what is wrong with asking the Australian people what they want? What is wrong with having a plebiscite, as Mr Abbott proposes? What is wrong, indeed, with going to an election? Let us make it a double dissolution election. What could be fairer? Let us see what we in this democracy would say. But no—the Greens and the Labor Party will join together. They will ignore the wishes and will of the Australian people and push through this horrible legislation, which will have such an impact on our cost of living and, indeed, the jobs of our fellow Australians.