House debates Questions without Notice
Fair Work Legislation Amendment (Closing Loopholes) Bill 2023
Meryl Swanson Paterson, Australian Labor Party
2:55 pm
My question is to the Minister for Workplace Relations and Employment. How does the Albanese Labor government's 'closing the loopholes' bill help deliver the pay and conditions that working Australians are entitled to? Has there been any misinformation in response to this bill?
Mr Tony Burke Watson, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations
I want to thank the member for Paterson for the question—someone who, in particular, in her whole time here, has been calling on this parliament to close the labour hire loophole that effects so many of the miners in her electorate.
When we were announcing the closing loopholes legislation, a few months ago, an ad campaign started. I said right from the start that the ad campaign was incorrect and that the legislation was never going to do what the ads were claiming—that somehow you'd lose the capacity to pay someone who has a lot of experience a different rate to that for someone who was brand new. Now that the legislation is here, I'm pleased to tell the parliament that they've stopped that ad of misinformation. They've now replaced it with two ads with different forms of misinformation. I just want to explain one of those too. It's an ad authorised by the National Farmers Federation. I've been dealing with the National Farmers Federation for a long time, right back to when I was agriculture minister. As an organisation, they often provide very good advice on policy, but they've never been that good when it comes to the rights of workers, historically. They just haven't been.
Unidentified interjection - Hansard doesn't record who said this
Hon. Members:
Honourable members interjecting—
Mr Tony Burke Watson, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations
No, it's about the National Farmers Federation. In the ad that they've launched, they've said—
Honourable members interjecting—
Milton Dick Speaker
Order! Members on my right, I can't hear what the minister is saying, because there is far too much noise in the chamber. I want to hear from the member for Wannon on a point of order.
Milton Dick Speaker
Resume your seat.
Honourable members interjecting—
Order. Member for Wannon, you're asking for a withdrawal on behalf of an organisation outside the parliament. Is that the point of order?
Honourable members interjecting—
Resume your seat.
Mr Tony Burke Watson, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations
To the point of order, I think the standing orders apply the same to employer organisations as they do to worker organisations—exactly the same.
Honourable members interjecting—
Milton Dick Speaker
Order! The minister will just pause a moment. The minister for the environment will cease interjecting. Member for Wannon, I just need you to state the point of order, not give a statement. The member for Wannon has the call.
Dan Tehan Wannon, Liberal Party, Shadow Minister for Immigration and Citizenship
I said it would assist the House if the minister withdrew that.
Rob Mitchell McEwen, Australian Labor Party
Never get between a Liberal and money!
Milton Dick Speaker
The member for McEwen will leave the chamber under standing order 94(a). Before the member for McEwen leaves, I just want to see if he can withdraw the statement that he just said. I didn't hear what he said, but I'm going to ask him to come back and withdraw.
Rob Mitchell McEwen, Australian Labor Party
Let the grown-ups talk! I withdraw.
Honourable members interjecting—
Milton Dick Speaker
Order. The member for McEwen will leave the chamber. The member for Casey is on thin ice—very thin ice. I'm going to continue with the minister's answer.
Mr Tony Burke Watson, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations
It might help if I explain what's in the ad. The ad claims that the labour hire loophole is going to affect farms and therefore is going to affect prices at supermarkets. That's the argument in the ad. I thought, 'Well, hang on; the labour hire loophole only applies if you have an enterprise agreement.' How many farms in Australia have an enterprise agreement where this loophole could possibly be used? Certainly there are some, but, to work it out as a percentage of the industry, I went to the regulatory impact statement that was prepared independently for the bill. I'll admit here that there are rounding errors, but, for the sector, where they say 'proportion of employees on enterprise agreements'—so there'll be a rounding error here; it's only to the nearest one-tenth of one per cent—the figure is 0.0 per cent.
So I thought, 'What could it be that they're opposed to in the bill, if they're not affected by the one that's in the ad?' It's not exactly gig economy work. So many of the casuals are itinerant; they'd never qualify for the casuals exemption. But there is one part the bill closes down that is a real problem in agriculture, and it is wage theft. That is the measure most relevant. Take cases of people like Kate, who was paid $4 an hour to pick oranges and who went dumpster diving to get food at the back of a Coles because she wasn't earning enough money.
David Littleproud Maranoa, National Party, Shadow Minister for Agriculture
You've opened up union thugs going to farms!
Milton Dick Speaker
The Leader of the Nationals will cease interjecting immediately.
Mr Tony Burke Watson, Australian Labor Party, Minister for Employment and Workplace Relations
Talk to the ombudsman who found the mango farm, where, out of 12 workers, four were paid nothing and the others were paid as little as $2.68 an hour. They are affected, but the ads are dishonest. (Time expired)
Michael McCormack Riverina, National Party, Shadow Minister for International Development and the Pacific
And they preach it three times a day, every day!
Milton Dick Speaker
The member for Riverina, I want you to be quiet. The Leader of the Opposition has the call.