Andrew Wilkie (Denison, Independent) Share this | Hansard source

I think it is fair to say it beggars belief that the government would be contemplating significantly expanding the cashless debit card system when what we've seen so far has been so problematic. I would have thought it'd be much more appropriate for us all to come in here in a collegiate way and discuss ways to remedy the current arrangement or at least give the current trials more time so that we can understand what we've got better and can, indeed, remedy it in the future before we even start a conversation about legislating to allow it to be rolled out in broad geographic areas.

There's already a lot of evidence pointing to the fact that this is not working as intended. For a start, the survey results are showing that about 75 per cent of the members of the community who are carrying these cards are telling us they don't drink, they don't smoke, they don't gamble, they're not on drugs and they can't for the life of them understand why they are being punished in this way and being forced to lose their independence and to carry one of these cards, with the limits it places on those people. Of course, that means that 75 per cent of the people carrying these cards haven't changed their behaviour, because there's no behaviour to change.

We've also learned already that this is very expensive. In the two trial sites in Ceduna and the East Kimberly, over two years, it has cost about $10,000 per card to establish and maintain the system for those cards. That's ludicrous. That's an absolutely absurd amount of money that is being, I suggest, wasted in the pursuit of the current arrangements.

I'll go further. What we've got currently is, frankly, racist. Let's not kid ourselves here. Let's not mince our words. Let's not forget the origin of the cashless debit card system. It was part of the Northern Territory intervention. It was a racist policy, and I think it is reasonable for people in the community to be concerned that it will continue to have a racist element or undertone to it, because it will be more likely to be expanded into geographic areas with Indigenous communities.

So it's too blunt an instrument, it is covering too many people that don't need it or shouldn't have one of these cards, it's too expensive and it's racist. No wonder there is such concern in the community. Even in my electorate of Denison, in Tasmania, as I go about my business I am routinely confronted by constituents who are concerned that the cashless debit card is coming their way. They've seen the way that this government and the previous Abbott government have responded to the community with, quite frankly, a real ideological vendetta, and they've seen any number of other changes that have happened with the welfare system in this country that give them reason to suspect that the cashless debit card is coming their way.

We've just got to look at the way the government under-resources Centrelink. Last financial year, 55 million calls went unanswered at Centrelink, an increase from 29 million the year before. We've had the robo-calls scandal. We had the attempt to implement policies that are focused unfairly on people who need the disability support pension, Newstart or youth allowance. We've seen these Taskforce Integrity letters go out co-branded with the Australian Federal Police logo. No wonder members of the community feel that this government is waging an ideological vendetta against anyone in the community who needs some help from the government in the form of a pension or payment.

A disproportionate number of people around Hobart who have expressed concerns to me about the cashless debit card are older Australians. They have also seen the way that this government, and the previous Abbott government, has gone after older Australians: the way super has been changed, including defined benefit pensions; the way access to the age pension has been reduced; and the way funding of aged care has been slashed.

This is now about a lot more than the residents of Ceduna or East Kimberley or the residents of some small areas the government might want to talk about. This has become an issue and a concern for many Australians, including many Tasmanians, who I think are quite understandably concerned that they're going to be lumbered with a cashless debit card themselves one day, even though they don't smoke—they can't afford to smoke!—they are not on drugs and they don't gamble. They are responsible with their money and they appreciate the money they receive from the taxpayer. They're worried that they also will be lumbered with the cashless debit card. Make no mistake: if this bill becomes law it will authorise the government to roll out the cashless debit card across broad geographic areas, virtually wherever it wants to. It is a slippery slope.

I notice that some members have already spoken, I think quite rightly, about the need for other government responses to what are often complex problems in the community. Why isn't the government talking about reforms to reduce the rate of alcoholism in this country? Why aren't we having a conversation about advertising and trading hours and the taxation regime for alcoholic beverages? Why aren't we having conversations in this place about more effective ways to deal with drug abuse and the ice epidemic in this country at the moment? Why isn't this place doing anything much about gambling reform? Instead of going after all of these people, most of whom don't have any problems with any of these substances or with gambling, why aren't we putting in place sophisticated solutions to what are complex social problems: alcoholism, domestic violence and gambling addiction? For a brief moment, like a falling star, there was a conversation the other day started and quickly ended about a sugar tax. Why aren't we talking about those sorts of things? Why aren't we talking about fixing the taxation regime on alcoholic beverages so that we don't have the ridiculous arrangement at the moment where someone can walk into a bottle shop and walk out with five litres of cheap wine for 11 bucks. No wonder we have alcoholism. They're the sorts of measures this place should be talking about and the sorts of issues this government, with the support of the opposition and the crossbench, should be addressing.

While we're at it, let's not forget that the main reason that people who rely on a government pension or payment get themselves into financial strife is that they're not getting enough money to live on to live a dignified life. Why aren't we having a conversation about raising the level of government pensions and payments so that people in this country who need a disability support pension, who need youth allowance, who need Newstart, and who need the age pension can live a dignified and reasonable life? Heavens, we can afford it! I don't know if people in this place understand it, but we are the 13th biggest economy in the world. There are almost 200 economies in the world and we're the 13th biggest. Our national wealth per capita is second only to the Swiss! By that measure, we are the second-richest country in the world, not the 13th. Surely we can afford to have sophisticated solutions to complex social problems. Surely we can afford to ensure that everyone who relies on a government pension or payment receives enough money that they can live a dignified and nice life.

The fact is, people who rely on government pensions and payments need pensions and payments. They're not dole bludgers or some other form of bludger. Almost all people on the disability support pension desperately need the disability support pension. Almost everyone who's on Newstart desperately needs Newstart. Just about everyone who is relying on the age pension, either in part or fully, needs every dollar of that money. They're not bludging off the taxpayer. I think it is downright scandalous that this government, the Turnbull government, and the Abbott government before it, have waged such a crude and shocking ideological war against the disadvantaged of this country and against the people in this community who need some financial support. We can afford it. We're the 13th richest country in the world. We're the second-wealthiest people in the world in national wealth per capita, after the Swiss. We can afford it.

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