Janelle Saffin (Page, Australian Labor Party) Share this | Hansard source

I begin my contribution on the motion to take note of the Prime Minister’s statement on Australia’s commitment to Afghanistan by paying tribute to our serving men and women, to those who have been injured—may we look after them well—to those who have paid the ultimate price, with their lives, and to their families that are left behind. May we also look after them well. I would like to give some context to some of the things that have been said in this debate and some of the things that we read in the papers. I will also talk a little about conflict prevention. In World War I, there were about 9.7 million military deaths and 6.8 million civilian deaths. In World War II, there were up to 25 million military deaths and somewhere between 40 million and 52 million civilian deaths. In wars now, from the figures I have found, over 90 per cent of deaths are civilian deaths. Sometimes when the debate is happening and being publicised, we are not so cognisant of these statistics.

I have had quite a number of constituents contact me and speak to me about this issue since I have been the member for Page, and this has increased recently because we are debating the matter here. Some people say that we should leave Afghanistan straightaway. Some people say we have to stay. Some people say that, if we continue to stay there, they will not be able to vote for us. Some people say that, if we do not stay there, they will not be able to vote for us. So people feel very passionate about this issue, as they should. Last year I had occasion to speak at the Bonalbo RSL subbranch. I sat with Tom Hale, who is a World War II veteran and an ex-POW from the Burma railway. I had some very interesting conversations with him. The topic of my talk at the RSL was Afghanistan. I took the opportunity to talk about some of the successes. We often hear a lot about what is wrong, what is not working, the failures, and we do not hear a lot about what is working. I was able to go through some of the things that are working. I was a bit daunted because there was someone there from 6RAR. I will not name him, but he was home on leave from serving in Afghanistan. It was a little bit daunting talking with him in the audience, but he was delightful and I know he serves us well there.

I also have had a conversation with a constituent who is the mother of a serving soldier in Afghanistan, and she feels quite passionate about it. She talked to me about when we will be able to leave and things like that, but at the same time she wants us there and wants the job well done. There is a conflict around it. Like a lot of members, I have been contacted by a whole range of groups from around the country, particularly social justice groups. The Australian Catholic Bishops Conference, ACFID, the Australian Anti-Bases Campaign Coalition, Pax Christi, Jason Thomas, who is a commentator, and all sorts of people and organisations have contacted us. My local newspapers have been talking about the issue. There was an editorial in the Daily Examiner by David Bancroft, the editor, with the headline ‘Keeping the Peace’. I would like to put on record the last two sentences from an article that Chris Masters wrote:

There is no question that our soldiers should leave Afghanistan, and leave sooner rather than later. But only once the job is done.

That is the overwhelming feeling that comes from the community. That is the commitment of the government and the opposition and the message of most of the comments that have been made in this place.

There is currently talk about whether or not we should talk with the Taliban. My information and experience leads me to the view that we always have to talk to those that we seek to make peace with in some way, whether that be through military or other means. But it should always be done strategically, for some sort of strategic advantage. The Taliban regime that ruled Afghanistan was toppled in 2002, but the Taliban are certainly a part of life in Afghanistan. There has been quite a lot of commentary about that recently. I always remember very well what the wonderful President Nelson Mandela said: ‘We don’t make peace with our friends.’ We make it, obviously, with our enemies.

A number of wars in the 1990s ended in negotiated settlement. Negotiated settlement is more than military victory alone. Military victory is one part of it, and a key part, and that is why we have the counterinsurgency. The counterinsurgency came a bit later in Afghanistan, and some people have made some comments about that, but we cannot revisit the past. David Kilcullen’s book Counterinsurgency defines ‘insurgency’ as:

An organised movement aimed at the overthrow of the constituted government through the use of subversion and armed conflict.

‘Counterinsurgency’, which we hear a lot about, is defined as:

An umbrella term that that describes the complete range of measures that governments take to defeat insurgency. These measures may be political, administrative, military, economic, psychological, or informational, and are almost always used in combination.

I think that sums up it up well.

I would like to acknowledge Major Anastasia Roberts, who is in my office as part of the ADF program, for pulling together some of that research for me. I would also like to acknowledge another person in my office, Luke Gosling, who served in the commandos in Afghanistan. So I have had some interesting conversations about Afghanistan in my office this week.

We know also that with counterinsurgency—again it comes out of Kilcullen’s book—there has to be respect for the local people. Their wellbeing has to be put ahead of any other consideration. We have to convince the threatened populations that we are the winning side. We need to develop genuine partnerships. We have to demonstrate that we can protect them and that their best interests are served by cooperating with us.

Afghanistan is a very complex country with complex terrain. It is difficult for the military to operate in a contested political environment, even at the behest of the government and even under the Security Council resolutions under which they operate, and there has been quite a number of them. It is a politically contested environment and therein lie some difficulties. And I have had a wee bit of experience in that particular area. Afghanistan is bordered by a range of countries and it has very porous borders. The country has a long history of conflict, not always of the locals’ making. The city of Kandahar is named after Alexander the Great. This conflict goes back a long way but it also has changing dimensions to it. It can be a very harsh and unyielding country. We know of some of the challenges with what is happening now: it is a difficult land to traverse; there are many peoples; and there are a number of conflicts. Then there is the issue of the resources of the ISAF, with 47 nations contributing to it. That in itself takes some organisation and coordination. There are multilateral development partners, multilateral donors and many other issues. Also, in Afghanistan in south-west Asia there are four of the most important regionally available water resources, and there are issues around that.

One thing I would like to comment on is that there is a Parliamentarians Network for Conflict Prevention—an international one—and I am on the executive of that. I have had teleconferences with women MPs from Afghanistan and also from Pakistan. I have had an opportunity to have some conversations because I chair the subcommittee on women, peace and security of the Parliamentarians Network for Conflict Prevention. At the Kabul conference earlier this year over 70 countries got together to talk about the way forward, cooperation, development partners, civil-military cooperation and all of those key issues. Working with women members of parliament, and others from the countries, we sent an open letter to the participants at the conference. A number of things were addressed in the document and I seek leave to incorporate the document in Hansard.

Leave granted.

The document read as follows—

STRENGTHENING THE ROLE OF WOMEN MPs IN PEACE AND SECURITY IN AFGHANISTAN

OPEN LETTER TO THE PARTICIPANTS AT THE KABUL CONFERENCE

The Parliamentarians Network for Conflict Prevention, in light of the upcoming Kabul Conference, call upon the international community and the Afghan Government to encourage and support the participation of women representatives and women in all aspects of the security dialogue from peacebuilding to conflict resolution, from stabilization to developmental aspects in Afghanistan.

It is incumbent upon all delegates of the Kabul Conference to be guided by and inculcate into actions and outcomes, including the conference organization, the SC Resolution 1325.

Stressing the important role that women MPs play in the prevention and resolution of conflicts and in peacebuilding processes, members of parliaments from Afghanistan, and from around the world:

Encourage the equal participation of women MPs and their full involvement in all relevant peace and security processes as well as in various multinational mechanisms for the prevention, management and resolution of conflict efforts and for the maintenance and promotion of peace and security;

Support the increased representation of Afghan women at all decision-making levels in national, regional and international institutions, especially concerning conflict prevention and conflict resolution;

Urge the international community and the Afghan government to ensure that the Afghan Plan for Peace and Reintegration (APPR) takes into account all constitutional rights of women and women MPs in Afghanistan;

Calls upon the participants at the Kabul Conference to ensure that the pledges of the international community are not used to undermine basic human rights for women in any way;

Requests the government of Afghanistan to take all necessary measures (including security ones) to ensure women are able to take part in key decision-making and leadership positions as well as supporting their participation in the upcoming parliamentary elections;

Noting a lack of support from the international community for women MPs in Afghanistan, the PN encourages parliamentarians worldwide to come forward and support concerns and demands of the Afghan women including women MPs.

I thank honourable members. It is a very nice letter and a useful contribution to the debate. It has been a very rewarding and interesting experience to have that contact. I will have more contact in December when I will be hosting a conference with some of the women MPs from the region to talk more about peace and security. I managed to get the letter to a range of the countries that participated, including Australia, and also to the Secretary-General’s office. Security Council resolution 1325 mandates that women have to play a very active and key role in all peacemaking efforts where we are trying to work through conflicts. It is easier said than done. But it is an important resolution and one that I work with in this particular area.

I am quite proud of Australia’s contribution. Our ambassador is Paul Foley. I have worked with him before. He is a good ambassador with a great team, and they are working to support all of the efforts. It is not easy for the civilians who work there or for the large number of NGOs that are working there doing great work on the ground. They are all working to help support strengthening the state. State building is not easy. In the debate I hear people talk about it being a corrupt government. Yes, there is corruption, but they speak as if it were abnormal, which it is not. We have to address it, but there is no way that the state of Afghanistan could be a corruption resistant regime overnight. These are things we have to work through. I have also looked at the situation with the elections. When my friend Peter Galbraith left his job there even he said that we have to stay the distance. He left for certain reasons to do with the election.

It takes time. We and the public become impatient. We of course do not like seeing our serving men die in wars, so we become impatient. But it takes a lot of effort and a lot of time to help rebuild a state. (Time expired)

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